Alchemy Forum 1151-1200

From January 25th 1996, the Alchemy forum was restructured and the messages were sequentially numbered. This is an unedited extract of messages 1151-1200.
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Thu Jun 20 14:51:20 1996
Subject: 1151 Alchemy Lab-Work question

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 09:11:33 -0400
From: Rick Grimes

> From: George Randall Leake III
> In looking at Frater Albertus last night it occurred to me that the most
> dangerous aspect to setting up a lab is that it might be interpreted as a
> drug producing lab. I live in Texas where people love to see innocent
> marijuana users sent to jail only to be sodomized by hardened criminals.
> The police here have free reign and hightech detection devices. Such a
> thing as a lab with constant heat source and beakers and so forth will look
> like a speed lab to the average cop who's never heard of alchemy (you gotta
> remember, reading books or engaging in anything "intellectual" or
> "artistic" is for "queerboys" and their "fag-hag" girlfriends) who will
> feel no hesitation at busting up the place and taking what they want as
> evidence. Do any of you have any practical suggestions here? Any lawyers
> out there with free advice? Has anyone ever dealt with this?

Well said, George. I wonder if drugs are not a lazy man's way to the
promised land? Besides, discussions about drugs and their glory may not
be too prudent on this forum; the internet is not yet a secure avenue.
RG

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1152 Trojanis

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 10:33:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: Claude Gagnon

The well-known Gnosis publishes in its summer 96 issue an interview with
a french alchemist...Francois Trojanis.
We were searching for him. Here he is!
Claude Gagnon

------------
Claude,

It was this article, and my wish for more information, that started the discussion on Trojanis!!

Adam McLeaN

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1153 Music

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 08:23:04 +1000
From: Zigas Enterprises

For those interested in Alchemical music,

I have found "Michael Maier"s Atalanta Fugiens" to be very interesting in how mr
M.M. translated his works to music score. The above book is translated and
edited by Joscelyn Godwin and a tape is available with the book. The Music is played
and sung to the original and in latin. I find the music inspiring when contemplating on operations.

"Phanes Press" has this book.

Fraternally, Misha

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1154 Music

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 13:50:53 -0500
From: George Randall Leake III

>Adrian Monk
>One would need first of all to define what precisely is meant by
>"hermetically" inspired music - if indeed it has any real meaning at all.
[edited for brevity....]
>There are many examples of music which apparently contain an
>"inner" meaning. The greatest example is probably the opera The
>Magic Flute by Mozart, a freemason, who wrote a considerable body
>of masonic music. The Faust Symphony of Liszt [edited for brevity...]
>The list could go on, but does it really mean anything? [more editing...]

*great post Adrian. If one is to make such subjective declarations, why not
include the music of John Coltrane?

*Might I suggest two directions which I think are constructive:
1) discuss music intended by the composer to have hermetic/alchemical symbolism
2) what about the whole numerology/musical scale connection made from
masonry to Agrippa's De Occulta

-G.Leake, 512-471-9117 taliesin@mail.utexas.edu

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1155 Science/magic

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 12:17:52 +0300
From: Ros Bangham

>>>ayindaath
>>>All people enter the study of the occult for the purpose of power - sexual,
>>>financial, physical, etc. It doesn't matter who - anyone who says that the
>>>reason they entered the study for the purpose of raising themselves to
>>>higher status is lying.

>---------------------------------------------------------------------

>This is essentially true, as far as it goes. Where it stops, though, is in
>realizing that that which drives one to power, control, etc., is what is
>called in advaita vedanta, ahamkara, which is the false self---the
>appropriated light of the Self, appropriated by the ego. So, it's true that
>that is one of the impelling forces.

Power & control etc are learned behaviors by the ego. It sees it's function
as doing what is required for the good of the self 'in the here and now.
Sort of the self's physical world interface.
We seem to be coming out of a time of whole-self denial - giving the ego an
opportunity to become super-egos or hyper-egos, where they appear to have
appropriated the light of the Self. But just as the ego filled the void
created by denial of spirit etc, a balance can be found through mind, body,
spirit work such as alchemy.
$.02
Ros

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1156 Catalog

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 96 14:59:18 -0000
From: photopro

The PHILOSOPHICAL RESEARCH SOCIETY, INC.
3910 Los Angeles CA 90027 puts out a catalog which has an Alchemical
section with a Bibliography Book listed . All Books are by Manly P. Hall
who was an historian of the Western Path of Mysteries but put out a book
called The Secret Teaching of All the Ages which gave accounts of all
philosophies and societies throughout time. This is worth having as a
resource backgroiund book on what the mysteries were about through
time.. It has Alchemical pictures and symbols too. There are three
editions, a soft cover for approximately $35, A hardcover very large
edition for about $165 and a delux limited edition for over $165. Each
one up has better color and detail photos. Years ago I bought the middle
edition at Weisers in NY. That store is no longer in existence but these
books and other very interesting subjects can be bought directly from
the publishing society. Write for their catalog. They also sell tapes and
lectures that he gave over the years. Basically he was an historian.
Later he claimed more. Certainly he was informed . The International
Order of The Golden Dawn, on this internet, has a wonderful selection of
Hermetic books listed on their website.
Wisa

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1157 plant comm./molecular structure

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 15:34:27 -0500 (EST)
From: OISPEGGY

Morgan Saletta

>Yes. I'm familiar with Flatland, though must confess I haven't read the
>entire thing, perhaps I'll pick it back up. Are you familiar with Tim
>Leary's book, Exopsychology (recently re-released as Info-psychology). He
>promotes a quantum eschatology, with levels of consciousness from
>multi-cellular, genetic (species consciousness), to the ultimate
>minitiarization of consciousness at the quantum level. His book the Game of
>Life attempts to create a new Tarot with links to the periodic table and the
>genetic code. Very interesting.

Never read it; sounds good. Nothing new though. Haven't shamans
always said this (more or less)?

>Also, the term enochion entities: is this a reference to the entities
>encountered when using the Sephiroth as a meditational device? Please excuse
>my ingnorance.

I was referring to the work of Dr. John Dee.

Regards,

- Peggy -
oispeggy@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu

PS: I think this is no longer discussing alchemy; and I would have sent
you email but I didn't see you address.

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1158 Where to begin?

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 12:50:50 -0700
From: Joe Champion

>>> I think some of the writings are far too complex. True
>>> wisdom is what we should seek! Just give me a formula and some exercises
>>> and set me to work!
>>You might try to find a copy of Frater Albertus' "Alchemical Handbook".
>>it is also a good place to startyour journey.
>>RG

For those wanting to test their skills at alchemy, there are two examples on
the Internet:

For the production of gold and platinum from lead goto:

http://www.netzone.com/~discpub/pb_au.html

For the production of gold and platinum from mercury goto:

http://www.netzone.com/~discpub/ht_pt.html

Both are modern day laboratory procedures which allow for simple observation
of alchemy (low energy nuclear transmutation). FYI -- these procedures have
been replicated by numerous external laboratories.

_______________________________
Joe Champion discpub@netzone.com
http://www.netzone.com/~discpub

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1159 Science/magic

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 13:25:42 +0300
From: Ros Bangham

>>>It doesn't matter who - anyone who says that the
>>>reason they entered the study for the purpose of raising themselves
>>>to higher status is lying.
>>
>> Not me. I started it in order to raise myself and I am not lying.
>> Actually, early on I would have chucked my esoteric studies in
>> a minute if I could just live a simple, happy life. Now I'm
>> hooked though. My point is that not everyone starts in order to
>> get power.
>> - Peggy -
>
>Yes, Peggy, so did I. If anything, it was the Divine Principle
>itself/Herself? that led me into it, from a very black patch of severe
>depression. Alchemy/Spirituality has been the path the Divine has used
>to bring me back to Life.
>Once I was dead, but now am free.
>$ita.

$ita,
In depression or in glory, you will never die.
You are the path. Alchemy/Spirituality is the experience.
(So was the black patch)
Nice to have you back.
Ros

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1160 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 13:36:53 -0700
From: tim scott

I believe "Keeper" wrote:

> >For those out their who think that "drugs" are not needed, I would suggest
> >that they re-evaluate that position.

To which John Charles Webb responded:
>
> I have experimented with mind expanding substances and I am in agreement
> with you.

[...thoughtful and intelligent commentary deleted...]

To which I would only like to make a couple of comments from my own
perspective. I am in substantial agreement with what John wrote. However,
I would only remark that the use of powerful substances is harmful is when
the "journeyer" is extremely immature or unbalanced emotionally. And of
course here is where judgments come in, which I want to avoid.

Leaning as I do towards the "Libertarian" view, I would rather the tools
be more available for exploration of states of consciousness rather than,
as in the USA, the government denying this by taking an extreme paternalistic
"zero-tolerance" attitude towards any (unsanctioned) substance. You cannot
absolutely protect fools (and youths) from their folly. A "reasonable" amount
of precaution can and indeed probably should be taken, the definition of
"reasonable" is where all the argument comes in.

[...snip...]

> I have understated the global dilemma as far as chemical pollution is
> concerned. The mystics and alchemists of the 17th century did not have to
> contend with chemical fertilizers and chemical additives bombarding their
> bodies in large quantities and varieties.

I don't agree with this position, in general, as it sounds like romanticism
of the past. I don't see any evidence that the average 17th century person
was any more healthy or long-lived than an average contemporaty person. In
fact, such things as surgery were almost always a death sentence in those
days (pre-anesthetic and pre-aseptic procedures), and the purity of meats
and other foods that you didn't immediately slaughter or prepare was often
what we would consider horrific. Further, public health measures were
primitive at best or non-existent, with human and animal wastes being disposed
of in the middle of cities or in nearby bodies of water used for drinking,
cooking and washing. (I don't mean to imply by this that large cities the
world over are now sparkling vessels of purity, however.)

But returning to John's later comment:

> So, for contemporary alchemists, it is highly recommended to engage one's
> self in restoring not only the consciousness but also the "container"
> (the body).

For the spirit of this statment I find nothing but admiration ("mens
sana..." etc.)

> emphasis ). AND just gradually create a lifestyle that is as close to
> natural as you can get it to be.

Again, I believe we need to be understand what you mean by "natural". Living
in caves wearing skins? Or what?

Best regards,

Tim Scott

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1161 plant comm./molecular structure

From: "Matthew Phillips"
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 14:05:41 -0700

You can find out about the enochian entities by consulting the Golden
Dawn tradition or the Thelemic tradition or by investigating John Dee or
by going into your local new age bookstore and asking them what they have
on the subject. It is a relatively popular subject nowadays. What the
enochian entities have to do with alchemy is, I would imagine, basically
the same as the relation any non-physical entities have.

matthew phillips
zingo@sprynet.com

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1162 gold/bacteria

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 15:15:59 -0600 (MDT)
From: Tom Hennessy

I found this on the web while checking out bacteria.
It is just a matter of getting 'raw' gold .. and culturing the bacteria?
Old gold mine tailings?

Who loves ya.
Tom http://www.nucleus.com/watchman

BACTERIA MAKE GOLD

The largest single lump of gold ever discovered on our planet was
found in Australia. It was the Holterman Nugget, and it was found in
Hill End in NSW on 19 October, 1872. The whole nugget weighed 235.1
kg, and contained 93.3 kg of pure gold. (Strictly speaking, the
Holterman Nugget was not really a nugget, but a mass of gold found in
a reef.)

Many of the world's large gold nuggets have come out of Australia -
the Hand of Faith (27.2 kg), the Welcome Stranger (73.4 kg), and the
Welcome (69. 9 kg). Ever since I was a kid, one thing about nuggets
has always struck me as odd - they look so 'organic', like a lumpy
mis-shapen potato. Well, my gut feeling might have been right.
According to some recent research, gold nuggets might have been
assembled by living creatures!

Gold is usually found either as a free metal in the gravel of streams
and rivers, or else intermingled with quartz in veins in the rock. In
1988, South Africa mined 621 tonnes of gold, the USA mined 205 tonnes,
with Australia at third place with 152 tonnes - a total of 978 tonnes
of gold. This gold would fit into a box 3.7 metres on each side. (The
richest goldfield in the world is the Witwatersrand in South Africa -
the rand, South Africa's currency is named after this goldfield).

There is some gold in the oceans, but it would be hard to get rich by
processing it. There are only 10 grams of gold in each cubic kilometre
of the Pacific and Atlantic Oceans. However, the Mediterranean Sea is
3 times more concentrated in gold (probably because it is landlocked,
and the gold washed in from the rivers takes longer to get diluted).

Gold is very inert, and very resistant to attack by chemicals. If you
bury some in your backyard, it will look the same in thousands of
years. It is used in jewellery, because it does not tarnish, because
it is soft and easy to work and because it is very rare.

About 65% of gold is used in the jewellery trade. The electrical,
electronic and other industrial fields use 25% of the gold mined. Gold
is an excellent conductor of heat and electricity, and does not
tarnish or oxidise. Gold can be beaten into a transparent gold foil
(0.00013 mm thick) over 500 times thinner than a human hair. Dentistry
uses about 7% of the gold produced. Here it is alloyed with other
metals (such as copper, silver, platinum and palladium) for
restorations, partial dentures, bridges and inlays.

Now some scientists believe that bacteria might have actually laid
down some of the gold deposits in the first place. After all, when a
bacteria called Pedomicrobium lives in water rich in dissolved
minerals, it will actually build up layers of iron or manganese oxide
around itself - like a shell. Scientists from Macquarie University
have suggested that many gold deposits in Venuzuala might have been
laid down by bacteria. And just recently, John R. Watterson of the US
Geological Survey, claims to have found proof in Alaska.

Now when most people find a lump of gold in their gold-panning dish,
they quickly turn it into cold hard cash - and have a party. But when
John R. Watterson got his gold, he looked at it with a scanning
electron microscope. To his surprise, most of the tiny particles of
gold that he had collected from nine Alaskan rivers were not solid
little lumps. Instead, they looked like gold-plated bacteria.

What he saw was a lacy pattern of tiny cylinders joined by thin rods.
The cylinders were the same size as the Pedomicrobium bacteria. Now
gold stops most bacteria dead in their tracks - with suffocation. It
blocks up the tiny holes in the cell walls through which food comes in
and wastes go out.

But Pedomicrobium, has an unusual way of reproduction. Most bacteria
make babies just by splitting into two separate cells. But
Pedomicrobium reproduces by budding. It stretches out a narrow stalk
which rises above the gilded cage closing around the parent bacteria.
This narrow tube then opens up (at the end) to make a new bacteria. So
new baby bacteria are continually being born just on the outside of an
expanding ball of golden death. It's a slow process - it takes over a
year to 'grow' a gold grain roughly the thickness of a human hair
(about 0.1 mm). It would take a long time to 'grow' a 70 kg nugget.
(Maybe we could speed the process up, by genetically engineering the
Pedomicrobium bacteria.)

There are similar lacy patterns in 2.8 billion-year-old South African
gold, and in 220 million-year-old Chinese gold. Of course, when you
melt the gold in a furnace, the carbon from the bacteria just
vaporises into carbon dioxide, leaving behind pure gold.

The bacteria don't actually ''make'' the gold - they just attract gold
that is already dissolved in the groundwater. Now we have absolutely
no idea why these bacteria can purify gold to almost 24 carat purity.
But maybe now we know what happened to Midas in the old Greek fable,
when everything he touched turned to gold. He might have been a victim
of accidental genetic engineering, when he got infected with some
Pedomicrobium bacteria. And perhaps there's a moral for us. If you
try to get too much gold, it will just suffocate you.

Copyright © Karl S. Kruszelnicki

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1163 Definition of Hermes

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 01:43:35 +0200 (MET DST)
From: douwe

>One would need first of all to define what precisely is meant by
>"hermetically" inspired music - if indeed it has any real meaning at all.
>In Greek mythology Hermes was the messenger of the gods and the
>guide of travellers. I assume that you mean hermetic in the sense of
>derived or deriving from the Hidden Wisdom (whatever one chooses
>to understand by that term, itself in need of definition).

Hermetics: Is beyond matter in a vacuum of space, where nothing being is
part of the natural laws (of dualism) can exist.
In this place opposites join, or better opposite pairs find each other as if
they found them self, and join inseparably.
In this vacuum there is no personality but only a transmission of IT, which
is even beyond this hermetic field.
You could say that it is neither this Heaven or earth, but you could call it
the New Heaven and Earth, as pointed out in Revelations.

The messenger-part is the transmission between IT and the world.
This is also why Toth is the god of science and the inventor of writing.
This writing is actually the arrangement of matter, which is likewise stated
in the first line of the Sepher Yetzirah 'With 30 and 2 paths of
wonderful-(the word is PLYAVTh, which kabbalisticlally means transmission)
wisdom (Hokmah) ENGRAVED: IH, IHVH TzBAVTh, ALHI IShRAL, etc...'
The engraving (ChQQ), or writing is the harmonious shaping of prime-matter,
and by this initial movement, the laws are made trough which any science is
enabled to exist.
(because of this you find the image of Hermes holding a book in which a
winged and a wingless bird are biting each tail.
This is a symbol of solve et coagula, or better the movement of matter.)

(Not long ago (message #1028) I have made a connection between the name
C.Rosencreutz and the word Beginning (BRAShITh) once, what I meant there
holds true here in this place, in fact most I wrote over there applies here
as well)

Hermes is three times great, because he is three in one, he rearranges the
soul, the spirit and the body, by the same way of his engraving
rectification, or rearranging of matter, (like this he stands just after the
beginning and just before the end when the heart is being weighed.
The writing can been seen like 'the writing on the heart', as it is called
in the bible, or 'God who reads all hearts and kidneys', because the heart
has been given a new radiation, or a new world to live in, it received a
polarity which is not of this world.
(BTW, by 'the kidneys' is meant, the polarity of the denser body... etc.)

I again hope that it is understood what I try to make clear by writing all
of this, because I try to give more information then just only some
additional weight to the brain.

Hmmm... I completely forgot to say about hermetic music, to my idea this
music is approaching the laws of harmony to such extent that they resonate
at the deepest base of your soul, to awake a seed, or a fire, which is
hidden there and to feed it and to make it grow.
This is not a question of taste (as I believe) but of subtlety of harmony,
and a ability on the side of the composer to follow these subtle radiations
(engravings) and to translate them into their denser counterparts as sounds.
(the only shame is that the performer doesn't always seem to be able to
perform it according to the insight of the composer, it makes is annoying
sometime to listen to music in which you can hear the intention of the
composer, but the inability of the performer(s) to follow this.
This is not too bad with orchestral music actually, because the en-mass
performance takes away the personality, and arrives at something looking
more like a harmonious group-spirit.)

But still, Hermetic music resonates and revives something like a seed which
lies hidden in the deepest depths of most of us, and bares it up to a
incredibly gentle and subtle bloom.

douwe

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1164 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 20:29:00 -0500 (CDT)
From: John D. O'Brien

> From: John Chas Webb

> cultural diet is quite toxic and qradually erodes our more sensitive
> faculties. I have gradually transformed my eating habits to include
> (exclusively) organic grains, fruits and vegetables. Once the body is
> detoxified from all of the chemical pollutants that are used in our food
> chain a natural high level of wellbeing is the result and there is no
> further need for "drugs". > John Chas Webb

I'm glad you and others recognize this. It is as important for the body
of the Alchemist to be pure as it is for the substances which we are
trying to purify.

I was too late to learn this and as a result I now have Multiple
Sclerosis. As a result of the MS I've had to redesign my entire being.
Luckily for me, I no longer have to labor for a living but I do have to
try to recover as much of my former energy as I am able.

Over the past few years experimentation with my own body lead me to the
vegetarian world and to the exclusion of many other processed foods.
I feel much better now.

John D. O'Brien obriens@sound.net

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1165 Tarocchi del Mantegna

Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 22:01:36 -0400
From: RawnClark@aol.com

I just wanted to note that I've continued my discussion about the TdM with
George, off Forum, since my comments were getting further and further from a
direct relevence to Alchemy.

On a directly alchemical note, I recommend for your perusal, an interesting
series of images from the Tarocchi del Mantegna --
C:22/Loica, B:35/Prudencia, B:32/Chronico, B:31/Iliaco

The first three images contain the only dragons found in the TdM. Though the
fourth image doesn't contain any dragons, its relevance to the series is
immediately apparent when viewed in the sequence I recommend. Comments???

:) Rawn Clark
19 Jun 96

----------------------------------------
Reproductions of the Tarrocchi de Mantegna are included on the web site under the section on articles. --- Adam McLean

Thu Jun 20 14:51:21 1996
Subject: 1166 V.I.T.R.I.O.L.

From: Matthew Phillips
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 00:14:26 -0700

How long has this word been used as an acronym for the phamous phrase
meaning something along the lines of, "Visit the interior of the earth
and by harmonizing all things thou shalt find the hidden stone."? In
Adam's book called the Alchemical Mandala the first mandala treated
(taken from Museaeum Hermeticum) is from the early 17th century. Are
there any similar precedents preceding this example given?

your local visual culture freak,
matthew

Thu Jun 20 14:52:05 1996
Subject: 1167 Alchemy Lab-Work question

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 09:11:41 -0400
From: Gilbert Arnold

In Canada, one may apply for a license to own and operate distilling
equipment. I would suggest speaking to the office of your congressman to
enquire if there are such laws in your state.

Blessings,

+Gilbert

Thu Jun 20 15:10:17 1996
Subject: 1168 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 05:40:26 -0400
From: KEEPERH2O

In a message dated 96-06-13 17:49:01 EDT,

>For those out their who think that "drugs" are not needed, I would suggest
>that they re-evaluate that position.

I came to the reluctant (at first) conclusion some time ago that "drugs" were
not only needed but *essential*. Of course every generalization such as this
will be rife with exceptions as our personal chemistry varies enough so that
the input of our senses are not the same to all of us (or we would all like
vanilla ice cream best). Speaking for myself, I needed to be shaken at the
very foundation of my being in this world to see some of the things I know my
father never saw, to his dying day. In "The Only Dance There Is", Ram Dass
reflects upon the value of LSD to his personal investigations. Later, in
describing his broad experience as a teacher of yoga, he was impressed often
that those students who "got it" quickest and best -- if not at all -- were
those with some previous experience with "drugs". He theorized that their
experiences gave them a better sense of what they were looking for. One of
my favorite ways to describe the issue is to raise the analogy of trying to
explain the color orange to a person who has been blind from birth, or the
flavor of a banana to someone who has never tasted one.

Love & Light!

Keeper

Thu Jun 20 15:10:26 1996
Subject: 1169 Where to begin?

Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 20:16:05 -0500
From: Logodox

>From: AW
>
>> Its really all about Your piece of the "creative" Godhead and the
>> harmonizing and rectification of Your Spirit, which when perfected can
>> accelerate perfection in the other kingdoms ! (via projection). Get around
>> all the multitudinous symbols of Alchemy and
>> build the new white stone with Your name written on it !
>> Logodox@Sound.Net
>
>Well said. I think some of the writings are far too complex. True
>wisdom is what we should seek! Just give me a formula and some exercises
>and set me to work!
>

After 30+ Years of Searching and Ancient Mystical Order Rosae Crucis and
Hundreds of books, I have probably read the formula thousands of times in
thousands of places and sorta know it (intellectually) but have not "become"
it yet, I suspect because I love the mystery and the search much more than the
answer and the finding!

Buddha realized the formula under the Bodhi Tree. Your being and all else
are actually only 1 thing...

Best,

Logodox@Sound.Net

Thu Jun 20 15:10:34 1996
Subject: 1170 Science/magic

Date: Sat, 15 Jun 1996 20:16:09 -0500
From: Logodox

>Date: Fri, 14 Jun 1996 15:48:22 -0700
>From: AW
>
>> Always for power eh ? You may not be able to imagine the state of
>> consciousness of a being (Human or otherwise) that has transcended the
>> "separateness" caused by the falseness of EGO. While something may be
>> nearly universally true, nearly isn't 100%.
>> Read any book on Buddhism or Tao TE Ching for examples.
>> Logodox
>
>Again, I agree, the powers will turn and deceive.

Yeah, As a realist, I recognized the sad reality echoed in Your statements
and agree with them in the huge majority. Much of the negatives of Life on
Earth spring from "self" ishness, although Ayn Rand defined a virtuous and
honest sort of balanced selfishness.

A strange point-of-view springs upon one whos transcends some of this
"selfness" (don't misunderstand, some selves are much greater and more
worthy beings than some phony pseudo-enlightened "masters"):

If one adopts the functional view that all is good in the world, as
ridiculous as this sounds; adopts a view of "fair" and kind dealings toward
all others, then the "gestault" seems to lean towards one's favor. By desiring to help others more, You are helped more !

Many (especially nowadays) are afraid to adopt a "giving" and "trusting"
attitude, to their loss.

Yeah, most seeking "enlightenment" are really seeking advantage (power) and sadly the huge majority of people considered "good" are quickly corrupted by power...In the alchemical symbology, trap her (nature) and she will flee from thee, she hates falseness, vanity, and being trapped (selfishness) above all things...

Best,

Logodox@Sound.Net

Thu Jun 20 15:10:45 1996
Subject: 1171 Homunculus

Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 11:09:02 +0200 (MET DST)
From: douwe

>From: Logodox
>>Talking of sperm he means retaining the sexual energy which will become
>>creative in different ways by building up the brain for instance.
>>The Homunculus, is a spiritual entity which one may first know as something
>>being half yourself but being more spiritual than yourself as you were.
>>It is said that the homunculus knows anything, and this is because of its
>>transparency, or better, because; the spiritual side of yourself is not
>>dense you are able to penetrate other worlds by which you may observe, and
>>know them.
>
>Do Ya think it has independent existence ? Is it a created being in any sense
>at all ?

It exist as unchangeable by itself, and out of itself, and it just our
perception in which it seems as if it grows or changes.
At first it is like as if you where coming out of a cave, as you still walk
inside the cave, then you may see through the depth of the tunnel the sky and
nature outside, but you only see a minor and subjective part of it.
As you advance by climbing further, you start to see more and more, (so that
it might look as if the world outside grows in front of your eyes) until
you leave the cave, but it is only then that you know this word objectively.

It is not less being created then the first Adam, but it has been living
(waiting) ever since.
It is for the same fact that 'the eye of God doesn't slumber or sleep',
because if this part of the world would be taken away then the world would
disappear at once.

douwe.

darus@xs4all.nl

Thu Jun 20 15:21:50 1996
Subject: 1172 Stibnite/oil of metals

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 09:40:39 -0400
From: Gilbert Arnold

Morgan Saletta wrote and asked;

"I am curious about the medicinal value of stibnite (antimony sulphide Sb2
S3). I understand that it is used in the purification of gold because of its
ability too join with the other metals, but not gold."

It is the S3 that combines with other metals in the gold and carries them
away to become part of the dross.

Morgan Saletta wrote

" However, it is also purported to be of the highest possible medicine to
those who are adepts."

Metallic Antimony is poisonous. Some Antimony compounds/chemicals
such as tartrates and others are still occasionly used in Medicine in small
doses. See Martindale's Pharmacopeia.

Morgan Saletta wrote

"Apparently the monks of the "antimoines" story were not adepts."

Moines and Antimoines have nothing to do with each other. Basil
Valentine was said to be a Benedictine Monk from the Monastery at Erfurt.

Morgan Saletta wrote

"Basil Valentine writes: from J. Read THROUGH ALCHEMY TO
CHEMISTRY, "Although antimony in its raw state is a poison, yet poison
can attract itself to poison more effectively than any other heterogenous
substance... there is hidden in it (the Star) a wonderful medicine, which
may be prepared from it""

The medicine alluded to has a threefold meaning;

1) Metallic Antimony used in metallurgical works for purification of metals.

2) Antimony compounds/Chemicals used to poison or repulse sicknesses
from the body as described earlier.

3) Antimony compounds/Chemicals used as catalysts in a process
somewhat akin to esterification to energize menstruums that are then
purified by humid sublimation.

Very little is known about the proper use of these medecines. not for
amateurs.

Morgan Saletta wrote;

"Does this refer to the idea that small doses of poison are medicinal
(homeopathy?). Or is this related to the idea of making oils of metal such as
gold. This is a process I don't really understand. Would some practitioners
care to help me here?"

I do not know about the homeopathy. Real metallic oils are subtle esters
that are made by circulating menstruums over metallic salts and then doing
a humid sublimation at low temperature to obtain a liquid that should not
contain any metal.

Blessings,

+Gilbert

Thu Jun 20 15:22:01 1996
Subject: 1173 Stibnite/oil of metals

From: Patrick J. Smith
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 1996 18:36:05 -0600

From: Morgan Saletta

> ...stibnite ...is used in the purification of gold because of its
> ability too join with the other metals, but not gold. However, it is also
> perported to be of the highest possible medicine to those who are adepts.
> Aparrently the monks of the "antimoines" story were not adepts.
> Basil Valentine writes: from J. Read THROUGH ALCHEMY TO CHEMISTRY, "Although
> antimony in its raw state is a poison, yet poison can attract itself to
> poison more effectively than any other heterogenous substance... there is
> hidden in it (the Star) a wonderful medicine, which may be prepared from it"
> Does this refer to the idea that small doses of poison are medicinal
> (homeopathy?). Or is this related to the idea of making oils of metal
> such as gold...

---As observed, Valentine was referring to the ability of stibnite to
join with impurity metals, and thus aid in the purification of gold.
In as much as the alchemists viewed the metals as potentially alive,
any substance that eliminated impurities was considered a "medicine
for metals". In addition, they believed, in accordance with their
belief in the underlying unity of nature, that medicines of the
metallic realm were also medicines of the animal and vegetable realms.
Thus Valentine reasoned that stibnite should also remove the
impurities from man. (I refer here to literal, physical impurities as
opposed to the spiritual kind, for those so inclined.)

The alchemical work aimed at obtaining that medicine which would remove
the impurities from metals in order to raise them to the same level of
perfection as gold, and thereby to transmute them. The metallic
medicine which accomplished this (the Philosopher's Stone) was also
thought to be capable of purifying the bodies of men, as it was
considered to be a great medicine of the animal and vegetable realms as
well. The alchemists had reasoned that the Biblical Patriarchs
attained great ages because they were less removed from the purity of
the Garden of Eden than we are. It followed that if the impurities
could be eliminated from a man's body, then he could potentially live an
extraordinarily long life. Thus reasoned out, Valentine proceeded to
try stibnite on his brethren, and hence the "antimoines" story.

I've suspected for some time that the reason antimony was symbolically
linked to the hermetic vessel (as in the Chariot of Antimony) was
precisely its use in the purification of gold. (It was in the
mysterious alchemical Vessel in which the purification took place.)
I'd be interested to know if others have considered this symbolism.

Some discussion took place a few months ago amongst the French
speaking participants of this forum concerning the use of stibium as
the base matter of the work. A few extracts follow, with my own
translations (such as they are):

-------------
Date: 20 Dec 95 15:50:39 EST
From: Jean Dauge
Subject: FRENCH : Materia Prima.

Commentaire de la gravure: Le char triomphal de l'Antimoine. (Basile
Valentin) Par E.Canseliet (disciple de Fulcanelli) dans L'Alchimie
expliqu\'{e}e sur ses textes classiques Pages 140.141

[Commentary on the engraving: The triumphal chariot of Antimony.
(Basile Valentin) By E. Canseliet (disciple of Fulcanelli) concerning
Alchemy explained in accord with the classic texts. Pages 140, 141.]

*******************

L'\'{e}tudiant aura surpris ce dernier d\'{e}tail comme il devra noter
qu' Aphrodite montre sur son bustier a la hauteur de l'ombilic le
globe crucif\`{e}re qui \'{e}tait r\'{e}serv\'{e} dans l'ancienne
notation \`{a} la stibine de m\^{e}me qu' \`{a} la terre.

[The student will have been surprised [by] this last detail as he will
have noticed that Aphrodite displays upon her bustier, at the height
of her navel, the cruciferous globe, which, in ancient symbolism,
was reserved to stibium just as to earth.]

-------------
From: Jaroslav Bujas
Subject: 1173b Re: FRENCH : Materia Prima.
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 14:54:50 -0500 (EST)

\^{E}tes-vous r\'{e}ellement s\^{u}r qu'il s'agit de la stibine? La
stibine n'est si vile, basse, et ignoble, comme les sages
sugg\`{e}rent. J'aimerais [?] bien entendre plus sur ce sujet de nos
ami Fran\c{c}ais.

[Are you really sure that the question is of the stibium? Stibium
is not so vile, base, and ignoble, as the sages suggest. I would
very much like to hear more on this subject from our French friends.]

-------------
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 1996 18:15:40 +0000
From: "Christian , Daniel Dumolard"
Subject: 1173c Re: FRENCH : Materia Prima.

>> montre sur son bustier a la hauteur de l' ombilic le globe
>> crucifere qui etait reserve dans l' ancienne notation a la
>> stibine de meme qu' a la terre.

Ce texte est tir\'{e} de l'ouvrage d'Eugene Canseliet (alchimiste
parisien d\'{e}c\'{e}d\'{e} il y a quelques ann\'{e}es) "Alchimie
expliqu\'{e}e sur ses textes classiques"

[This text is drawn from the work of Eugene Canseliet (a parisian
alchemist who died a few years ago) "Alchimie expliqu\'{e}e sur ses
textes classiques".]

> Etes-vous reelllement sur qu'il s'agit de la stibine? La stibine n'est
> si vile, basse, et ignoble, comme les sages suggerent. J'aimairais bien
> entendre plus sur ce sujet de nos ami Francais.

Canseliet parle r\'{e}ellement du sulfure d'antimoine, donc de la
stibine, sur lequel il s'est mis \`{a} travaille vers 1950. Avant la
seconde guerre mondiale il travaillait sur le sulfure de plomb,
c'est-\`{a}-dire la gal\`{e}ne. Ces deux mati\`{e}res n'ont en commun
que leur soufre natif!

[Canseliet indeed spoke of the sulphide of antimony, hence of stibium,
upon which he set to work around 1950. Before the second world-war he
was working on the sulfide of lead, that is to say, galena. These two
matters have in common only their native sulphur!]

En France, aujourd'hui, le courant de pens\'{e}e qui fait de
l'antimoine la mati\`{e}re de base du grand'\oeuvre est tr\`{e}s
repandu (ce qui vient du fait que Canseliet pr\'{e}tendait \^{e}tre le
disciple du ma\^{i}tre FULCANELLI). D'autres travaillent autrement!

[In France, today, the current of thought which makes antimony the
base matter of the great work is very prevalent (which stems from the
fact that Canseliet claims to be the disciple of the master
Fulcanelli). Others work otherwise!]

Au sujet de Fulcanelli, voici ...ce qu'il a
\'{e}crit dans son livre "Les demeures philosophales", tome 1. (Les
numeros entre parenth\`{e}ses renvoient au numero des pages, dans
l'\'{e}dition de Jean-Jacques Pauvert, \`{a} Paris...

[Concerning Fulcanelli, here is ...what he has written in
his book "Les demeures philosophales", volume 1. (The numbers between
parentheses relate to the page numbers in the edition of Jean-Jacques
Pauvert, in Paris...]

[French text deleted for brevity]

"(397) The most learned of our friends in the traditional cabbala
have doubtless been struck by the similarity existing between the way,
the path traced by the hieroglyph which assumes the form of the figure
4, and the mineral antimony or stibium, clearly indicated by this
topographical word. In fact, the natural oxysulphide of antimony was
itself called, amongst the Greeks, Stimmi or Stidi; now, Stidia is the
road, the path, the way through which the investigator (Stideus) or
pilgrim passes on his voyage; it is this which he treads beneath his
feet (Steido). These considerations, based on an exact correspondence
of words, have not escaped the old masters nor the modern
philosophers, whom, lending it the weight of their own authority, have
contributed to the spread of the ill-fated error that vulgar antimony
was the mysterious subject of the art. A regrettable confusion, an
invincible obstacle against which hundreds of seekers have striven in
vain. Since Artephius, who began his treatise 2 with the words:
``antimony is of parts of Saturn...'' until Philalethes, who entitled
one of his works: Experiences in the preparation of the Philosophic
Mercury by the regulus of martial Antimony star and silver, and
passing through the Triumphal Chariot of Antimony of Basile Valentine,
the dangerous affirmation, in his hypocritical positivism, of
Batsdorff, the number of those left to fall into this crude trap is
simply amazing. The Middle Ages stood witness as the puffers and
alchemists (398) volatilized, without one result, tons of mercury
amalgamates of antimonial gold. In the XVIIIe century, the learned
chemist Jean-Frederick Henckel confessed, in his Treatise of the
Appropriation, that he was long given to these expensive and vain
experiences. ``The regulus of antimony, said he, is regarded as a
means of union between mercury and the metals; and this is the reason:
it is not mostly mercury and it is not yet perfect metal; it has
ceased to be the one and has begun to become the other. Yet, I must
not pass over in silence the fact that I have enterprised uselessly
with very great effort in order to unite gold and mercury most
intimately through the means of the regulus of antimony.'' And who
knows if, today, good artists still follow the deplorable example of
the medieval spagyrists? Alas! everyone has his folly, everyone is
attached to his own ideas, and nothing we can say will prevail against
such a tenacious presumption. No matter; before all else we must help
those who do not live upon chimeras, we will write for them alone,
without preoccupying ourselves further with the others. Recall
accordingly that another analogy of words would permit us likewise to
infer that the Philosophers' Stone might issue from antimony.
Consider that the alchemists of the XIVe century called Kohl or Kohol
their universal medicine, based on the arabic words al cohol, which
signify subtle powder, a term which has lately acquired, in our
language, the sense of water-of-life (alcool). In arabic, (399) Kohl
is, they say, the pulverized oxysulphide of antimony, which was used
by the moslems for dying thir eyebrows black. The grecian women made
use of the same product, which they called Platnofqalmon, which means
large eye, because the use of that article made their eyes appear
quite large (rac. -platus, large, and ofqalmos, eye). Behold, one
will think, these are suggestive relationships. We could certainly
have been of the same opinion, had we been ignorant of the fact that
there was not a single molecule of stibium in the playophthalmon of
the Greeks (sulphide of mercury sublimate), the Kohl of the Arabs and
the Cohol or Cohel of the Turks. The latter two, in fact, were
obtained by calcination of a tin granulate and from gall-nut. Such is
the chemical composition of the Kohl of the oriental women, which the
ancient alchemists have supplied as a term of comparison in order to
teach the secret preparation of their antimony. This is then the
solar eye which the egyptians named oudja; it figures also, among the
masonic emblems, surrounded by a glory in the center of a triangle.
This symbol offers the same signification as the letter G, seventh of
the alphabet, initial of the vulgar name of the Subject of the Sages,
represented in the middle of a radiant star. This is that matter
which is the saturnine antimony of Artephius, the regulus of antimony
of Tollius, the true and sole stibium of Michel Maier and of all the
Adepts. As for the mineral stibium, it possesses none of the required
qualities and, in whatever manner one should care to treat it, one
will never obtain from it the secret dissolvent, nor the Philosophic
Mercury. And whether Basile Valentine gave to (400) the latter the
name of pilgrim or of voyager (stideus), as he must, we say to him,
cross six celestial towns before fixing its residence in the seventh;
whether Philalethes assures us that he alone is our road (stibia),
these are not sufficient reasons to claim that these masters have
designated the vulgar antimony as the generator of the Philosophic
Mercury. This substance is too removed from the perfection, from the
purity and from the spirituality which the humid radical or metallic
seed possesses, --- which, moreover, one cannot find on earth, --- to
be truly useful."

Allison Coudert wrote:
"Over the centuries the meaning of many alchemical terms
changed. Kohl, for example, originally meant black sulphide of
antimony and was used in the ancient world as a cosmetic. It then
came to designate an impalpable powder of a sublimate. Finally, it
was used of any volatile substance or spirit; thence came the word
`alcohol'."

Alcohol was of special interest to the alchemists in part because the
Stone was said to be made by combining fire and water. And alcohol
was apparently a water which possessed fire. In fact, alcohol was
often referred to as `elixer vitae'. Finally, just for interest,
Rulandus wrote:

Stibium: ...11. A species which can be changed, by much cooking, into
Lead.

Stibium or Stimmi---Antimony, Black Sulphur; a substance of Dead Lead,
found in German mines, sometimes in a vein of its own, sometimes
combined with Silver. If melted, it frequently turns into Lead. It
is astringent and emollient, and is specially good for the eyes...

I suspect that the statement "...is specially good for the eyes..."
derives from the cosmetic use of Kohl. It's also apparent that
medieval alchemists often confused galena with antimony. So the whole
subject of the role of antimony in alchemy gets confusing to say the
least.

--Patrick

Fri Jun 21 08:34:00 1996
Subject: 1174 Alchemy Lab-Work question

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 16:34:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Art Kunkin

I had a major run-in with the Los Angeles authorities about my
laboratory when I moved to Salt Lake City in 1980 to work with Frater
Albertus. The experience might be of interest to others on the forum who
are concerned with the legal implications of owning a laboratory. Of
course, the situation will vary from city to city and certainly from
country to country. In some countries the ownership of distillation
equipment is illegal and in the U.S. it is technically illegal to produce
even a small amount of absolute alcohol in a home laboratory. For this
reason, the Paracelsus Research Society in Salt Lake City had a federal
license permitting it to purchase and produce absolute alcohol. However, I
don't believe that in practice there would be any official prosecutions for
producing a small amount of absolute alcohol in connection with the
preparation of herbal tinctures or alchemical experiments. Nevertheless, a
rigid interpretation of the law is always possible.
In my case, I had left about a hundred cartons of chemicals in a Los
Angeles storage facility when I moved to Salt Lake City because the
chemicals were to be picked up by an alchemy student. The chemicals had
been given to me by a chemistry professor at the University of California
who had previously been storing them in his garage for the University.
There were a lot of chemicals. It took me five trips with a pickup truck to
move them from his garage to my storage. (When I decided to manifest a
laboratory, I really manifested!) However, the owner of the storage
facility where I moved the chemicals knew they were there and was not
concerned since I had assured him they were not a fire hazard.
However, the alchemy student did not pick the chemicals up as
promised, the space reverted to the landlord since I was no longer paying
rent and was no longer in the city, and the landlord, faced with moving the
chemicals himself, called the police. The bomb squad came, looked through
the many boxes and found a small bottle of picric acid that had come from
the USC pharmaceutical department where it had been used as a component of
a medicine for menstrual problems.
I remember the bottle of picric acid very well because it was
ancient, ugly looking, maybe twenty years old and actually covered with
cobwebs, and the bottle was filled with crystals of acid. The bomb squad
said it was an explosive although, in fact, they told me that the only way
to explode it would have been to insert electrodes and attach the
electrodes to an electric battery -- and that was far from the case. That
bottle hadn't been opened for twenty years! All the other chemicals were
innocuous as was the picric acid in fact. However, the landlord notified me
that the police insisted on hiring a private company specializing in the
removal of hazardous chemicals for $30,000 (yes, thirty thousand dollars!)
to remove the boxes of chemicals. I offered to come back, box the chemicals
in barrels and move the chemicals myself to a mutually suitable dump but
that wasn't ok with the police. They insisted on the private company and
the $30,000.
Meanwhile, Channel 7, a local television station became involved
and on several news broadcasts reported that I, a fairly well known Los
Angeles journalist, was manufacturing bombs. The Los Angeles District
Attorney then assigned two investigators to interview me. I told the
investigators that until I had moved I was a chemistry student at LA City
College and that my interest in alchemy had led me to move to Salt Lake
City where I was editing a magazine about alchemy. So the two investigators
began reading books about alchemy while they were making up their mind
whether or not to recommend criminal prosecution!
The situation was becoming very nasty so I finally explained to the
investigators and the landlord that, in fact, I was actually not the legal
owner of the chemicals that were in storage and that the real owner was the
University of California. I had taken custody of the chemicals only on the
condition that I would inventory all of the chemicals and give a copy of
the inventory to the USC professor, use what I wanted, but that if the
University ever wanted anything back, they would have a legal right to get
the chemicals back. The professor himself was storing the chemicals on this
basis and I was able to provide the police with a copy of the inventory
that I had done. So if they wanted $30,000, I told them they should go
collect it from the University.
Once the name of the University of California was involved, everything
calmed down. I presume that the University was embarrassed by the discovery
that it had been storing chemicals in private garages and began exerting
its influence. The District Attorney decided it did not have a basis for
filing criminal charges against me as I am clearly not a bomb maker and,
sometime later, I reimbursed the landlord for the $1500 he actually
expended in removing the chemicals. I felt it was a matter of honor to so
reimburse the landlord even though he had posted a legal notice after I
moved out that he was taking legal possession of all the abandoned property
on the premises. Ende Gut, Alles Gut! (For those who don't know French:
All's well that ends well!).
But then, to complete the story, I must report that after the last Los
Angeles earthquake, Fire Department investigators became aware of my new
laboratory while they were checking buildings in my area for earthquake
damage. So I explained that I was making herbal medicines and haven't heard
anything since. That was several years ago.
My conclusion, therefore, is that anyone who has an alchemical
laboratory is always in risk of investigation. So don't make bombs and
avoid explosions or other mishaps that will call attention to you by
following all safety procedures!
The fact is that ignorant people have a bias even against simple
chemistry. Once I was in a bookstore looking at an ordinary chemistry
textbook and experienced a lecture from an old lady about the dangers of
drugs! However, the odds are that nothing much will happen if you are not
doing anything wrong. And if one has to work on alchemy in secret, so be
it. I don't think that anyone who knows the importance of alchemical
research will allow themselves to be intimidated by a political authority.
Cordially, Art Kunkin. kunkin@cinenet.net

Art Kunkin
Publisher and Editor, World Wide Free Press
URL: http://www.wwfreepress.com/
Voice: 310-455-2451 E-Mail: kunkin@cinenet.net
Snail Mail: 115 S. Topanga Canyon Blvd, Suite #166

Fri Jun 21 08:34:09 1996
Subject: 1175 Drugs needed?

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 19:12:50 -0700
From: Andy

> From: al4302
> Drugs are and have always been apart of the art

Please clarify whether you are saying "apart" or "a part".

Fri Jun 21 08:34:18 1996
Subject: 1176 Where to begin?

Date: Thu, 20 Jun 96 16:09:23 CDT
From: Dan Hill

What is the formula? Are you saying philisophicaly that the mystical marriage of CR involves the self and the higher self in union?

ave,
dan

Sat Jun 22 15:58:47 1996
Subject: 1177 Homunculus

Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 12:22:13 -0400
From: Jfruther

About the matter of the homunculus I have taken a part of "The Magical
Revival" by Kenneth Grant. One may think about Mr. Grant, what ever may want,
but as a collector he is great.

The formula described in the following is very usefull and if intelligent
changed and modified, it works VERY well.

--
Taken out of "The Magical Revival", by Kenneth Grant:

...An essential part of Spare's technique lay in deliberate forgetfulness,
and this is the part which a novice finds extremely difficult. One is
reminded of the king who lavished a fortune on an itinerant alchemist who had
successfully manufactured the Philosopher's Stone. After giving the king
lengthy and complicated instructions, which the king repeated by heart, the
alchemist smiled and said approvingly: "Yes, your Highness has remembered
every detail perfectly; there is just one further point to remember. For
three minutes before the Alchemical Substance congeals, you must concentrate
your mind upon its lustre as it seethes in the alembic, but during this time
you should on no account let the thought ofgreenness cross your mind for even
a moment." The king thanked the alchemist and prepared to make the Stone.
Everything went according to plan until the last few minutes, when the mind
of the king was invaded by an army of green objects which he was powerless to
banish.
With Spare's sigils the case is somewhat similar. The reason he gives for
forgetting the desire at the time of invoking it lies in the fact that for
the operation to succeed the conscious mind must have no inkling of the
transaction. Consciously formulated desires take time to materialize;
subconscious desires can be made to materialize very swiftly. Consciousness
of the desire vitiates the entire process, so a method had to be found
offorgetting the desire during the period of magical evocation. Spare called
the process "union through absent-mindedness, and advocated the yogic method
of emptying the mind of all but the sigil. This is not always successful so
as an alternative he suggests the sigillization of perennial desires, desires
that are sure to arise periodically, as for instance the desire for beautiful
women. Several such desires are then sigillized, scrambled together, and laid
aside for several days. On reassembling the cards upon which they have been
drawn, the operator is unable to remember precisely what sigillized what! The
rite is then comparatively easy to accomplish for the requires only
concentrated thought.
Spare often supplemented the process by a sexual formula which endowed it
with added efficacy. He derived most of his sex-magical formulae from a
Delphic Pythoness who communed with him during sessions of automatic writing.
This Delphic Oracle was probably the spirit of old Mrs. Paterson, guiding him
from beyond.
One such formula enabled him to "give life to the autistic, by an earthenware
virgin". In view of the present-day predilection for auto-erotic aids to
ecstasy, the resuscitation of the dildo3 and the widespread curiosity about
the sorcery of sex, Spare's formula of the Earthenware Virgin is of
particular interest, though for Spare it had an exclusively magical aim.
Until he received this formula he had, as he put it, "copulated merely with
the atmosphere, or rode whores, witches and bitches of all kinds, there being
few virgins".
In order to translate a specified desire from the level of subjective
consciousness to the material or objective plane, the Pythoness instructed
him to construct an urn in conformity with the dimensions of the erect penis.
Sufficient space but no more was to be left at the end of the vessel in order
to form a vacuum when the phallus was inserted. The cavity was to contain the
sigillized wish, which was automatically consecrated at the moment of orgasm.
The greatly enhanced pleasure induced by the suctional power of the vacuum
increased the size of the penis and caused an unusually prolonged orgasm. At
the critical moment, the desire was to be vividly visualized and held
steadily in mind for as long as possible. When the mental image began to wane
and disappear the urn was hermetically sealed and buried in a casket filled
with earth, or in the ground itself.
Spare maintained that this was the formula used by the ancient Greek urnings;
hence the designation. In one of his unpublished writings he gives the
following instructions: "Bury the urn at midnight, the moon being quartered.
When the moon wanes, disinter the urn and-while repeating a suitable
incantationpour its contents as a libation on to the earth. Then re-bury it."

As the sperm would by that time have congealed, Spare advised a replenishment
before the second "burial". He describes the Earthenware Virgin as "the most
formidable formula known; it never fails and is dangerous. Hence, what is not
written down must be guessed.
"From this formula was derived the legend of the genii of the brazen vessel
associated with Solomon."
Whether this is so, I do not know, but there is a curious illustration in
Payne Kright's celebrated Discourse on the Worship of Priapus (London, 1865)
which is not satisfactorily explained in the text. It is in two parts and
depicts a male figure with sexual organ erect; in his raised right hand he
holds a vase-shaped sheath which he is about to clamp upon the phallus. The
second part of the illustration shows the same image, but with penis drooping
languidly after ejaculation, and the waist of the figure girdled with fruits
symbolic of the rite's fulfilment. There are also one or two illustrations in
Reinach's Repertoire des Vases Peints (Paris, 1899), which suggest a similar
magical practice.
Spare could undoubtedly materialize atavisms from his own subconsciousness
and clothe them fleetingly in the sexual ectoplasm (or astral semen) of his
atmospheric copulations.
Occasionally, these entities actually achieved a degree of density sufficient
to make them visible and even palpable-to other people. He called them
"elemental automata" or "intrusive familiars". They frequently copulated
amongst themselves, engendering offspring simultaneously. Spare has depicted
many of these creatures engaged in their peculiar pursuits and has written
several accounts of the Sabbath which he attended in their company. Old Mrs.
Paterson's influence is here very marked, for he used her likeness as the
type of the ancient witch in many of his drawings.
--------

Best wishes in Light!

V.I.T.R.I.O.L.

Sat Jun 22 15:58:57 1996
Subject: 1178 gold/bacteria

Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 16:16:29 -0500 (CDT)
From: John D. O'Brien

> From: Tom Hennessy
> BACTERIA MAKE GOLD
>
> The bacteria don't actually ''make'' the gold - they just attract gold
> that is already dissolved in the groundwater.

Speaking of attracting Gold; I was interested to find out some years ago
that certain plants attract Gold. Horsetail is one example.

John D. O'Brien obriens@sound.net

Sat Jun 22 15:59:09 1996
Subject: 1179 Homunculus

Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 21:33:57 -0500
From: Logodox

You Said:
>It exist as unchangeable by itself, and out of itself, and it just our
>perception in which it seems as if it grows or changes.
>At first it is like as if you where coming out of a cave, as you still walk
>inside the cave, then you may see through the depth of the tunnel the sky and
>nature outside, but you only see a minor and subjective part of it.
>As you advance by climbing further, you start to see more and more, (so that
>it might look as if the world outside grows in front of your eyes) until
>you leave the cave, but it is only then that you know this word objectively.
>It is not less being created then the first Adam, but it has been living
>(waiting) ever since.
>It is for the same fact that 'the eye of God doesn't slumber or sleep',
>because if this part of the world would be taken away then the world would
>disappear at once.

Are You talking about an already existing state of mind/being as in Super/Sub
Conscious ? I intrepreted Bombastus as taling about a "familiar" or spirit
that could be "astral?" projected to a distant scene in the real world...
Or perhaps the "serpent eye" in Yoga ?

In "Suggestive Inquiry Into the Hermetic Philosophy" the introduction mentions
"intra-molecular" vision. Alchemical literature states that the Soul or
Unis Mindi is "ALL" powerful in Nature (outside of the Body).

Douwe, do you (we) think that any portion of our (human) being is
ultimately, absolutely and actually real and permanent ? on any plane of being ?

Sorry to ask such difficult questions but I detect advanced wisdom on Your
part and value Your opinion/knowledge on these higher matters.

Thanx, Logodox (LOGO- the Nous, or word, or law ... dox a belief in...)

Best,

Logodox@Sound.Net

Sun Jun 23 16:35:26 1996
Subject: 1180 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 14:27:53 -0700
From: AW

Dear friends;

Please enlighten me as to what you think the advantages of using mind
altering drugs would be to the esoteric. The way I see it is that the
drug is causing a temporary alteration of one of the basic elements which
allows a temporary vision or feeling. I feel this is totally unnecessary
and can be achieved through diligent practice with a permanent effect.
You also chance the psychological or physical addiction to the substance.
Speaking from experience, find another solution!

AW

Sun Jun 23 16:35:33 1996
Subject: 1181 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 15:38:54 +0300
From: Ros Bangham

>From: tim scott
>
>I believe "Keeper" wrote:
>>For those out their who think that "drugs" are not needed, I would suggest
>>that they re-evaluate that position.
>
>To which John Charles Webb responded:
>>I have experimented with mind expanding substances and I am in agreement
>>with you.
>
>>AND just gradually create a lifestyle that is as close to
>>natural as you can get it to be.

Outside of maybe San Fransisco in 1967 (& the like), I don't know when
taking 'mind expanding' drugs might have been used to create a 'natural'
lifestyle. Further, unless you know the compound, it's composition and
strength, and it's function, what you're getting is fucked. (Adam - there's
no better term)
That's not mind expanding - other than injecting a new (or repeated)
experience into your mind, nor is it natural.

If you're one of the lucky ones, you may find something meaningful to
reflect on. You may not.
Other than the truly ... prepared, it's a crap shoot. And even then, it's
not THE way, it's only one of many. This road will lead you into
experiences otherwise unavailable to you. But it will also bypass others.
hmmm!
Ros

Sun Jun 23 16:35:41 1996
Subject: 1182 Christians and mysticism

From: et7@student.open.ac.uk
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 96 09:31:09 BST

Dear Jon,
Some of us who think of ourselves as alchemists also think of ourselves
as Christian!
There is a great tradition in Christianty, particularly the monastics,
toward mysticism, which comes very close to the Alchemical philosophy.
But most Churches regard all such deep questioning as this as
intrinsically evil, and would quote "He who is not for me is against
me". I've experienced many churches, and it has been a harrowing thing.
There is too much indoctrination. The church has become a social
institution, to use socio-speak; as such it has to use methods of
controlling people, such as theology taught, through sermons or hymns,
etc. Some of the things I came up against in my churches were harmful
to me. I would not say all churches are like this, only that all the
ones I have been involved in were much closer to clubs than to what
they should be. Or perhaps we shouldn't have "churches" at all?
I now find that after about 3 years of not attending any church, I can
think clearly, get my philosophy and my spirituality in line, and just
BE, on my own, or with GOD.
God or the Divine, or however you call Him/Her/It, doesn't change, . Our
attitudes to God change. Our descriptions to ourselves and others of WHO
or WHAT is God, that changes. And we limit God in our selves and our
lives by superimposing those images on God.
Alchemy is a different approach, which allows the individual to follow
the path laid down for her or him, by God, or by herself.
It does tend to be a rather lonely path, though. But at least on this
path I can be true to myself, and not have to pretend to believe things
I don't deep down.
And I believe I know God far better, both through studies of Christian
mystics as well as alchemy, than I ever did when a confessing member of
a church.
Most of the mystics seem to have gone the same way, living alone or in
seclusion, spending most of their time alone with God, or just alone?
Also there is a deep distrust in many Christians of anyone who looks a
little deeper or further than the "Ontario Blessing" or asks, "Is this
all there is?"

Boo
Still crazy, after all these years....

Sun Jun 23 16:35:49 1996
Subject: 1183 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Sun, 23 Jun 1996 04:32:20 -0400
From: KEEPERH2O

Tim, I was erroneously credited with the statement, by Morgan Saletta, and
posted 6/13, "
For those out their (sic) who think that "drugs" are not needed, I would
suggest that they re-evaluate that position." However, I did agree with it.
Since I have been misquoted twice, permit me to repost my original response:

Date: Mon, 17 Jun 1996 02:39:42 -0400
From: KEEPERH2O

I came to the reluctant (at first) conclusion some time ago that "drugs" were
not only needed but *essential*. Of course every generalization such as this
will be rife with exceptions as our personal chemistry varies enough so that
the input of our senses are not the same to all of us (or we would all like
vanilla ice cream best). Speaking for myself, I needed to be shaken at the
very foundation of my being in this world to see some of the things I know my
father never saw, to his dying day. In "The Only Dance There Is", Ram Dass
reflects upon the value of LSD to his personal investigations. Later, in
describing his broad experience as a teacher of yoga, he was impressed often
that the students who "got it" quickest and best -- if not at all -- were
those with some previous experience with "drugs". He theorized that their
experiences gave them a better sense of what they were looking for. One of
my favorite ways to describe the issue is to raise the analogy of trying to
explain the color orange to a person who has been blind from birth, or the
flavor of a banana to someone who has never tasted one.

Love & Light!

Keeper

Sun Jun 23 18:33:50 1996
Subject: 1184 Alchemy Lab-Work question

Date: Sun, 23 Jun 1996 12:52:58 -0400
From: Raymond P. Cullen

> In looking at Frater Albertus last night it occurred to me that the most
> dangerous aspect to setting up a lab is that it might be interpreted as a
> drug producing lab. I live in Texas...

For those of you would be alchemists in Texas or similar states, the solution
to the authorities problem is to be completely (or almost completely) honest.
Go through the mind-numbing permit process and suffer the interview with whatever
authority does the permitting. Just say that you are developing plant tinctures for
cosmetic purposes. This is the truth. Surely you can come up with an original (and legal) use for plant materials. I have two friends from Texas who have received permits. Don't
start a lab without the permit. I am working on a natural herbicide for kudzu. It involves
plant collection, fermentation, distillation, calcination...

Ray

Sun Jun 23 21:07:57 1996
Subject: 1185 Homunculus

Date: Sun, 23 Jun 1996 14:52:10 -0400
From: Jeffrey

It is possible by a focus on both the innerworld of the unconscious and the
more removed spirit world to bring to life entities that may appear as a
homunculus. This is also akin to the idea of the golem, whereby rabbis used
the magic letters to bring to life inanimate objects. The same idea is also
found in shamnism. Further, what appears as a small living being within can
be a very powerful spirit-ally. Focusing awareness and attention on such
beings can be dangersou unless they feel good to the person working on them,
but if they feel positive they can be fed and nourished through a process
Jung called active imagination and through alchemcial rpocedures of
converting other forms of energy into them.

Mon Jun 24 15:13:50 1996
Subject: 1186 Plant mutations/communication

From: John Chas Webb
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 1996 11:47:44 -1000

|John wrote: (snip) just gradually create a lifestyle that is as close to
| natural as you can get it to be. (as a tool for doing The Great Work)

Tim responded:
| Again, I believe we need to be understand what you mean by "natural".
Living in caves wearing skins? Or what?
| Best regards,
| Tim Scott

**************************************************************************

Plato wrote that we are, in fact, cave dwellers, who have forgotten our true nature and have allowed ourselves to become mesmerized by "shadows". Also, many of the great adepts allude to the fact that we are already wearing "animal skins". (a symbol which suggests that the indwelling consciousness has become captivated by its physical form).

When I suggest that the Alchemist should strive to live a "natural" lifestyle the key word to use to interpret "natural" is BALANCE. (Equilibrium between the masculine and feminine - between the container and its contents)

When I refer to Alchemy I mean the method or process of the distillation
of consciousness (mercury) out of its physical form to the "point" where it can begin to identify (re-identify) with the golden light (Sun) of the soul. So, it is within this context that I offer you the following explanation of the advantages of creating a "natural" lifestyle.

Man's technological advancement has vastly outpaced our physical evolution. We have produced many technological miracles, however, we have also produced many substances and electronic wave vibrations which are highly destructive to our bodies.

"IF" the purpose of alchemy is to cleanse the consciousness and emotions
so that we can rediscover divinity THEN it is a really good idea to not bombard our bodies with the hundreds of chemical additives which have found their way into our diet.
These substances are dealt with as toxins by our bodies and have the cumulative effect of obstructing the work of the alchemist BECAUSE the result of any "experiments" is GREATLY effected by the inner states of the observer.

It is almost impossible to discern how chemical pollution has impacted
upon your own consciousness until the decision is made to conduct an experiment and to gradually eliminate (from the diet) "foods" which are actually poisoning your body and creating stress in every organ.

Perhaps this is not your "cup of tea". Nevertheless, I have shared this information because it is part of the course which my own work has taken. Our bodies are feminine/receptive relative to our mercurial consciousness. As a culture we treat our bodies the same way which we treat the earth, which in turn, is the same way which we treat those of the female gender. (As above so below, each element is a symbol of the other).

So, in summary, many of us have gone off willy-nilly worshiping the proceeds of our minds and all of its technological innovations with almost utter disregard for how our technological "miracles" impact upon the earth and especially our bodies.

One cannot fuly realize how potently they have been effected until they
begin to extracate themselves from the madness. Alchemists have always worked in secret and this is due, in large part, to the fact that the first "extraction" of the alchemist is to remove him/herself from the common lot of humanity and to begin the life's work of divine evolution. If this is initially easy to do then see it as a symbol of the difficulty of performing many of the extraction experiments logged into many of the symbolic alchemical texts!

Best regards,

John Chas Webb
johnboy@aloha.net

Mon Jun 24 22:41:50 1996
To: alchemy@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1187 Perpetual lights

Date: Mon, 24 Jun 1996 23:34:09 +0200 (MET DST)
From: douwe

I wondered if anyone has done some experiments with perpetual lights.
This is a side of alchemy which seems hardly practiced (probably because of
the supposed small part of material gain), but I have the impression that
the transfigurative radiation of such a lamp would be splendorous as a link
to the inner Light. (and therefore ideal for tombs or temples.)
I hope that some reactions will follow.

douwe.
darus@xs4all.nl
Four Mighty Ones are in every Man.
A Perfect Unity Cannot Exist but from the Universal Brotherhood of Eden...
-The Four Zoas, William Blake.-

Tue Jun 25 08:10:07 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1188 Perpetual lights

From: Bill Bunn
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 1996 22:18:51 -0400

I'm interested in this aspect of Alchemy but I don't know much about it.
Could you fill me in?

Thanks.

Bill Bunn

Tue Jun 25 13:36:27 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1189 Gold/bacteria

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 03:27:43 -0600
From: Kelly Kelley

> BACTERIA MAKE GOLD
>>
>> The bacteria don't actually ''make'' the gold - they just attract gold
>> that is already dissolved in the groundwater.
>
>Speaking of attracting Gold; I was interested to find out some years ago
>that certain plants attract Gold. Horsetail is one example.

"Attract" may not be the right work, more like "Collect" as in collect from
the surrounding earth. Some plants of collect gold but the earth must
contain the gold. An old time prospector did a vary through study of
an apparent gold supply going up a gulch in western USA. After careful
assay of all the dirt as he progressed up the gulch to determine the source
he discovered that the source apparent ended. Then he examined the
particular type of plant that was growing there and found that they contained
gold. He also determined that this particular plant was apparently creating
gold because the earth didnt contain any. His conclusion was that the plant
was "manufacturing" the gold. He later went on to establish a thesis of
the process and was successful in reproducing the process albeit with
electronics. Another interesting facit of this is that aloe vera contains much
gold, rodium, and iridium although in a modified "monatomic" form that
does not respond to normal spectroscopic analysis. See " http://www.
netzone.com/~discpub/ and http://www.netzone.com/~discpub/whiteau.html"

love you all

kelley@2sisna.com
Kelly Kelley email: kelley2@sisna.com

Tue Jun 25 13:36:41 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1190 Plant mutations/communication

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 08:28:03 -0400
From: Peter Principle

Hello and BTW the list has served up some really fun reads over the last
month or two. Thanx. I'm usually lurking as I am not an actual alchemist
but I am an enthusiast.

I too came to the mindset that encourages me to read lists like this
through the intervention of mind altering substances in the late
sixties/early seventies, and although I see no bad side effects on myself
from my experiences, I do realise that there are many limitations to this
approach.

Any one wishing to know techniques to achieve a stable and reliable
relationship with that state of mind forced on the user, with possible
damaging consequences to certain organs of spiritual perception, by the use
of such drugs should read:

Knowledge of the Higher Worlds and it's Attainment by Rudolph Steiner.

Peter

>From: AW
>Dear friends;
>Please enlighten me as to what you think the advantages of using mind
>altering drugs would be to the esoteric. The way I see it is that the
>drug is causing a temporary alteration of one of the basic elements which
>allows a temporary vision or feeling. I feel this is totally unnecessary
>and can be achieved through diligent practice with a permanent effect.

Tue Jun 25 21:07:33 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1191 Kelly's Gold Web Page Recommendation

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 13:34:06 -0500
From: George Randall Leake III

*just to let you all know ahead of time, the recommended web-page at the
end of this story is to David Hudson White Powder Gold Page.

>From: Kelly Kelley
>"Attract" may not be the right work, more like "Collect" as in collect from
>the surrounding earth. Some plants of collect gold but the earth must
>contain the gold. An old time prospector did a vary through study of
>an apparent gold supply going up a gulch in western USA. After careful
>assay of all the dirt as he progressed up the gulch to determine the source
>he discovered that the source apparent ended. Then he examined the
>particular type of plant that was growing there and found that they contained
>gold. He also determined that this particular plant was apparently creating
>gold because the earth didnt contain any. His conclusion was that the plant
>was "manufacturing" the gold. He later went on to establish a thesis of
>the process and was successful in reproducing the process albeit with
>electronics. Another interesting facit of this is that aloe vera contains much
>gold, rodium, and iridium although in a modified "monatomic" form that
>does not respond to normal spectroscopic analysis. See " http://www.
>netzone.com/~discpub/ and http://www.netzone.com/~discpub/whiteau.html"

Tue Jun 25 21:07:44 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1192 Gold/bacteria

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 14:53:47 -0700
From: AW

Has anyone considered the possibility of earth's spirits having anything
to do with the gold phenomenon?

>>BACTERIA MAKE GOLD
> >
> > The bacteria don't actually ''make'' the gold - they just attract gold
> > that is already dissolved in the groundwater.
>
> Speaking of attracting Gold; I was interested to find out some years ago
> that certain plants attract Gold. Horsetail is one example.

Tue Jun 25 22:54:03 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1193 Plant mutations/communication

From: John Chas Webb
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 10:40:56 -1000

| >From: AW
| >Dear friends;
| >Please enlighten me as to what you think the advantages of using mind
| >altering drugs would be to the esoteric. The way I see it is that the
| >drug is causing a temporary alteration of one of the basic elements
which
| >allows a temporary vision or feeling. I feel this is totally
unnecessary
| >and can be achieved through diligent practice with a permanent effect.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

You are absolutely right when you say that diligent practice yields desirable permanent effects! However, the infrequent experimentation with non-addictive substances can give you a glimpse of a "higher" reality and also reveal many shadow areas in the mind and emotions. Once it is that you have a "transcendent" experience it can fortify your beliefs in multiple levels of reality.
Our culture allows the selling of substances which produce UNconsciousness to be big business. In fact, we now have the most "medicated" society in the history of Man. Many of these "legal" substances alter the reality of the "user".
They create the illusion that you are not in pain. The sacred use of psychotropics can show you places where you are in pain and this "pain" or "error" can be permanently removed by the diligent practice of more traditional methods.
Here on Maui there is a peyote ceremony conducted by an American Indian medicine-man. The ceremony takes place once a month according to astronomical cycles. Everyone who participates is asked to remain on the premises (outdoors in a lush tropical landscape) throughout the night (until sunrise). Those participating always receive a gift from spirit.
This is a good example of how an enlightened spiritually oriented culture should operate.
The group uses "medicine" prepared by an expert which is taken in a sacred ritual conducted by someone who is an expert in his field. In my opinion this is a classic example of how an enlightened culture conducts purification rituals.
An additional "purification" ritual poo-pooed by the culture is fasting.
Fasting adds nothing to the GNP and requires no purchases and is an extremely powerful tool for clearing the consciousness.
So! How does all of this relate to alchemy? IF the purpose of the Alchemist is to dedicate him or herself to the Great Work of extracting the consciousness out of matter then all tools must be, at least, investigated with an open mind. The plant kingdom produces powerful "medicines" for restoring balance. The classical Alchemist has always worked with substances and materials produced by the earth and did not let fear in any form block his or her path.
If you say no to "chemicals" you will feel so great that you will never have the need to use "controlled substances".
In the underworld (hell) the only reliable information comes from the senses and anything which expands your consciousness is immediately made illegal. If one can get a clue as to where in the universe one is then the work of the Alchemist takes on so much more meaning. (smiling).

Very Best Regards,

John Chas Webb
johnboy@aloha.net

Wed Jun 26 09:06:13 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1194 Homunculus

Date: Wed, 26 Jun 96 13:35 NZST
From: Pat Zalewski

>Jfruther
>About the matter of the homunculus I have taken a part of "The Magical
>Revival" by Kenneth Grant. One may think about Mr. Grant, what ever may want,
>but as a collector he is great.
>The formula described in the following is very usefull and if intelligent
>changed and modified, it works VERY well.

I have enjoyed Grants first two major books enormously. I felt that
Aleister Crowley and the Hidden God ' had touches of real genius in it. I do
not share his views though adopting Lovecraft's mythology as real entities
and have found his later books somewhat dissapointing though he did make the
OTO's 9th degree under Crowley. It has been my experience that any body
secretion used for life giving properties such as a homunculus has an
etheric life density of about less than a minutes and this decreases every
second. In India this concept is not new to tantra and we were taught not go
with it. An etheric elemental being created will come without seminal fluid.
I saw one of these in india and it was created at will by Vivandatta. I also
saw a photo of it taken at the same time to be sure we were not seeing
things (I had the film developed). You can relate this back the hebrew Golem
as well which also does not need seminal fluid (if you wish to believe the
tales about it). Spare was also a genius of sorts ( I do not use the term
lightly) and had the ability to condense his etheric body through the
framework of a sigil with the release point being an orgasm, in many
respects what he acomplished was very Reichen. The point I am getting at
here is ,is this alchemy or sexual magic or a combination of both? It may be
not quite within the brief of this forum's discussion.

Wed Jun 26 09:06:21 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1195 Plant mutations/communication

From: MR DARREN M SWANICK
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 22:29:06, -0500

Dear friends,

In reponse to AW's thought I must agree with the idea that mind
altering drugs do not help but hinder the seeker on the path, save
one possibility. I have often thought that if invited to attend a
native "as in native american" circle, and if presented with the
opportunity to participate in a ritual I might consider using one of
their natural herbs 'to fully attain the experience at hand" the key
words being Natural and ritual. The 'high' attainable by man made
narcotics taken freely with no intention is pale and only an illusion
when compared to the experience of being intimate with the hidden
mysteries of the universe.

DMS

Wed Jun 26 09:06:29 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1196 Make Gold?

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 23:55:33 -0400
From: Gary L. Childress

I'm new to the alchemy forum.
I was wonfering how did the Eygptians make things in to GOLD? Does any one or has
anyone ever figured it out?
Somebody explain to me what bacteria has to do with gold? What kind of bacteria?

Light & Love

Gary Childress

Wed Jun 26 09:06:37 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1197 Christians and mysticism

Date: Tue, 25 Jun 1996 11:25:23 +0000
From: A'yin Da'ath

>Some of us who think of ourselves as alchemists also think of ourselves
>as Christian!

In point of fact, I'd have to say that almost all of western mysticism is
inseperable from Christian patterns or thoughts. I myself do not worship God
nor Christ, however, the thought modes and patterns of initiation still
center around Christian ideas. Most recruits to such societies as the
G.'.D.'. are brought in as Christian, then slowly taught more and more about
other gods (I believe. Please correct me if I am wrong). This either makes
them non-Christian, or enhances their faith to such a degree that they have
become, in fact, more Christian than your average Church goer or Priest.
They know more of the Bible, the metaphors contained therein, the secrets
and wonders of the afore-mentioned faith.

Anyways, just to throw another bomb into the works for further study-

The Bible, according to Hebraic tradition, begins BRAShITH ALHIM. Now most
translate that as 'In the beginning there was God.' However, if you want to
be truly correct (and I think a Jew or Christian would want to be so with
their Holy Book), the translation should read 'In the beginning there were
Gods.' In point of fact, YHVH, Tetragrammaton or the singular god, was not
mentioned until a great deal later in the story (mid-Genesis, I believe).

So my question is, what the hell is this? Are they(the mystics who wrote the
Bible) acknowledging the existance of other Gods, or are they discussing the
multiple facets of YHVH, or what is going on?

A nice little puzzle for all of us to work on.

X
ayindaath@worldnet.att.net
http://users.aol.com/ayindaath/

Wed Jun 26 16:06:46 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1198 Homunculus

Date: Wed, 26 Jun 1996 09:46:26 -0400
From: Jfruther

>From: Pat Zalewski
>
>>Jfruther
>>About the matter of the homunculus I have taken a part of "The Magical
>>Revival" by K.G. ....

I for my point think alchemy and sexual magick as well as tantra (as long as
we talk about the so called "left hand path") is nearly the same. As you see
in tantra there is also a lot of alchemy and what we call sexual magick is a
very new concept. But as you said, a bit to complex to discuss in this forum.
If there are some of the forum members are interested in this matter, we may
post it in this forum or establish a private link.
Pat, thanks for your elaborate comment upon my posting!

Yours...

Wed Jun 26 16:06:54 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1199 Drugs needed?

Date: Wed, 26 Jun 1996 15:08:36 +0100
From: al4302

>From: Andy
>
>> From: al4302
>> Drugs are and have always been apart of the art
>
>Please clarify whether you are saying "apart" or "a part".

I mean part, I am assured that great use is made
of ether in the physical process, is that not a drug?
What I think we tend to forget these days is the mind
set of the Alchemists of old. They were not subject to
the torrent of anti drug propoganda that we have had
to suffer for the last 80 years. Would Paracelsus have
considered a mushroom in the woods a drug?
He used Opium in incense, for the seeing of spirits, in
fact it is said that he brought it back from the east
and introduced it to the west, I do not know if this is
true and I do not think it really matters. This is just
an off the top of my head example of one philosopher that
is said to have died in the bar pissed out of his mind.
It was once said to me "After the work is done what else is
there but to relax into velvet" I'm sure that this was
a flippant remark in reaction to me not understanding
how my spiritual teacher could be as un-holy as to
be drunk and I now know there is much to be done.
My misunderstanding lay in the fear that
had been installed within my mind from a child by
a society and a religion that at odds with the true
purpose of existence. I do not mean to sugest that we
should all start to take drugs or that enlightenment can
be found through the use of a substance such as LSD, but
how many people have found a spiritual path after the
experiance?
The present day drug culture is only Alchemy of the great
Stone and I have every confidence that it will one result
it a more enlighened society.

Regards; Your Old Friend

Wed Jun 26 16:07:02 1996
To: alchemypost@colloquium.co.uk
Subject: 1200 Make Gold?

Date: Wed, 26 Jun 1996 09:47:23 -0500
From: George Randall Leake III

>From: Gary L. Childress
>I'm new to the alchemy forum.
>I was wonfering how did the Eygptians make things in to GOLD? Does any one
>or has anyone ever figured it out?

*welcome to the Alchemy Forum...you might want to include your email
address in your signature line so we can respond to you individually.

*I did see on a documentary that gold refining was indeed done in Egypt,
ca. 200 BC roughly.

*However, I think your question is more directed to alchemical teachings
I'm sure, and while there's no tangible evidence that they made actual
physical gold in the alchemical manner, theurgical purification seems to
have been a part of the Egyptian spiritual tradition. Be careful though.
Many things have been erroneously attributed to the Ancient Egyptians from
Tarot Cards to the myth of Hermes Trismegistus.

-G.Leake, 512-471-9117 taliesin@mail.utexas.edu