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Inner alchemy archives - Black SunBack to alchemy forum page . Back to Inner alchemy archive.From : Adam McLean Date: 24 Mar 1998 A colleague of mine is exploring the idea of the 'Black sun' in alchemy. The most obvious examples of this are the 19th illustration to the 'Splendor solis' manuscripts, and the 'Ripley Scroll'. There are a number of other examples contained in illustrations and references in alchemical texts. I wonder if anyone has any particular information on the 'Black sun' and its meaning in alchemy. Adam McLean From: Keith McMullen Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 Jung's source for 'sol niger' is Mylius, 'Philosophia reformata.' (1622) Jung references the 'sol niger' several times in MYSTERIUM CONIUNCTIONIS, and there is an image from Mylius in PSYCHOLOGY AND ALCHEMY, p.88, fig. 34. Keith McMullen From: Anthony M. House Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 Dear Adam, Curiously enough, the information I can direct you to is on your website. Visit the lectures given by Jean Dubuis in the nature of the numerous black sun(s) of the planets of our solar system @ this url: http://www.levity.com/alchemy/pon-indx.html Anthony From: Anthony M. House Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 Dear Adam, Curiously enough, the information I can direct you to is on your website. Visit the lectures given by Jean Dubuis in the nature of the numerous black sun(s) of the planets of our solar system @ this url: http://www.levity.com/alchemy/pon-indx.html Anthony From: Stanislas Klossowski de Rola Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 Dear Adam, I have studied the Black Sun in the Splendor Solis manuscripts for my study on the subject which Thames & Hudson might publish soon (we have to finally come to a mutual agreement on the exact format.) At any rate the Black Sun refers to the Nigredo and to the necessity of "Killing the Live to revive the Dead" which alchemical axiom means that all vulgar metals including especially vulgar gold are considered dead and have to be made "green" again. This axiom which has practical, symbolical, and psychic correspondences is one of the essential keys of the Art of Hermes. Stanislas Klossowski de Rola From: Jeffrey Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 Stanislas wrote: >I have studied the Black Sun in the Splendor Solis manuscripts >for my study on the subject which Thames & Hudson might publish soon (we >have to finally come to a mutual agreement on the exact format.) >At any rate the Black Sun refers to the Nigredo and to the necessity of >"Killing the Live to revive the Dead" which alchemical axiom means that all >vulgar metals including especially vulgar gold are considered dead and have >to be made "green" again. This axiom which has practical, symbolical, and >psychic correspondences is one of the essential keys of the Art of Hermes. I look forward to seeing your book. I have been long interested in this topic as well as the related ones of the eclipse and the sun and its shadow. I have noted the imagery of the black sun in dreams to denote a very harsh and negative fate; a period when consciousness must be diminished so that the unconscious has a chance to intervene and make itself felt. The latter happens when the conscious position is dead and needs greening by the addition of new material and affect from a deepr layer. This is usually felt as a depression or experienced in a disease or bodily issue of some kind. Consciousness can be so diminished that it becomes a dangerous time. Any ideas on the sun and its shadow? Jeff Date: 26 Mar 1998 From: John Ashpool I have recently come across the concept of 'black suns' in a selection of Réné Guénon's collected articles recently published in English as 'Fundamental Symbols '; (see under the chapter 'The Solstital Gates'.) If I have correctly understood his ideas, the 'midday sun' corresponds to 'the manifested' and 'the midnight (black) sun' to 'the unmanifested', (to use the terms of his translator.) I quote: 'since the 'culmination ' of the visable sun takes place at midday, that of the 'spiritual sun' can be considered symbolically as taking place at midnight..' In the chapter 'The Cave and the World Egg', when discussing the 'athanor' he equates by implication the Sun to the solar order and the 'midnight' or 'black sun' to the 'polar' order: (to the third birth or 'sublimation'.) In another article, 'The Black and White' he returns to the idea pointing out that in the Katha Upanishad Arjuna is the White and Krishna the Black - 'those who know Brahma call them darkness and light'. I would be interested in learning more about the author. Am I right in thinking that he was and remains a controvertial figure, or am I confusing him with someone else? john ashpool Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 From: Mateus Nicolau Carneiro Cunha john ashpool wrote: > I have recently come across the concept of 'black suns' in a > selection of Réné Guénon's collected articles recently published in English > as 'Fundamental Symbols '; (see under the chapter 'The Solstital Gates'.) > I would be interested in learning more about the author. Am I right > in thinking that he was and remains a controvertial figure, or am I > confusing him with someone else? dear mr ashpool, Guénon was a typical French occultist in the beginning of his career, associated with Papus and Guaita. He was also a Freemason during this period (first decades of the present century). However, things started to change as he was probably initiated by an Egyptian sufi master that passed through Paris at that time. He never named this person. He then started to write against what he saw as western deviations from 'traditional thinking', in books such as 'l'erreur spirite', 'le théosophisme, histoire d'une pseudo-religion', his masterpiece 'la crise du monde moderne' and 'le règne de la quantité et les signes des temps'. On a more constructive note, he wrote many fine books on the relations between the various esoteric traditions, including alchemy. He is a difficult writer, very dense and impersonal, but paradoxically enough he writes with extreme clarity, but demands from his reader the quality of attention. He never tried to be popular. Indeed, after his first wife died, he left France and settled in Cairo, where he openly embraced Islam (as suitable to himself in particular, as he stressed), married the daughter of a great sufi master, had two daughters and...died. His life was outwardly uneventful, at the antipodes of Crowley's for example. He left a wide group of admirers, including some important French alchemists, as René Alleau, Bernard Roger, and Jorge Camacho. His best book on alchemy is probably 'La Grande Triade'. I hope that helps. yours, mateus Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 From: Kay Chandler I have heard of the Black Sun also called the invisible sun from an initiate of esoteric Rosicrusians (not AMORC). I was told it was a secret chamber of the heart chakra in Tipareth. It also related to the mysteries of the sacred beetle of the Egyptians, Khepra, called also the God of the Midnight Sun. Kay Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 From: Kay Chandler Jeffrey wrote: > I have > noted the imagery of the black sun in dreams to denote a very harsh and > negative fate; a period when consciousness must be diminished so that the > unconscious has a chance to intervene and make itself felt. The latter > happens when the conscious position is dead and needs greening by the addition > of new material and affect from a deepr layer. This is usually felt as a > depression or experienced in a disease or bodily issue of some kind. > Consciousness can be so diminished that it becomes a dangerous time. > Any ideas on the sun and its shadow? Dear Jeff: Your sensitivity promps me to tell about the secret chamber of the heart where the initiation of the Black Sun take place. In mystical Christianity this is the "Eloi, Eloi, Lama Sabachthani?" that Christ uttered in the 9th hour upon the cross. I do not believe it has to do with the Nigredo as another forum member suggested. I do believe that it has to do with letting go of everything under the midday Sun and discovering the kind of faith that can pass through the darkest moments.... I don't think that everyone goes through this kind of test. In the Egyptian mythology, I suspect this is how the scarab earned his wings. Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 From: Robert Word Kay Chandler wrote: > In the Egyptian mythology, I suspect this is how the scarab > earned his wings. Is the Black Sun of alchemy the same as Kheph-Ra or is it different from Kheph-Ra? REW Date: Sat, 28 Mar 1998 From: mike dickman Kay Chandler wrote: >In the Egyptian mythology, I suspect this is how the scarab >earned his wings. to which Robert Word then wrote: >Is the Black Sun of alchemy the same as Kheph-Ra or is it different from >Kheph-Ra? Examine ATU XVIII, 'The Moon'... Also, at the risk of becoming VERY boring (!), Charles Ponce's articles in Maitreya II, III and IV... More than just simply about "accepting 'the negative'", it has to do with giving up all attachment, all support, and accepting responsibility for the entire quality of one's being... On this level, yes, certainly Khephera and the Black Sun are pointing towards the same thing. m Date: Sun, 29 Mar 1998 From: Richard Patz Robert Word wrote: >>Is the Black Sun of alchemy the same as Kheph-Ra or is it different from >>Kheph-Ra? In the language of Ancient Egypt the root of the name Khephra is "kh-p-r" which means "to become". Khephera appears to represent our point of becoming - in my view, much like Kether in Qabalah. Here's a sample of text from Budge's "The Gods of the Egyptians" vol. 1: "I became the creator of what came into being. I came into being in the forms of Khepera coming into being in primeval time. I came into being in the forms of Khepera. I became the creator of what came into being, that is to say, I produced myself from primeval matter which I made." khepera kheper kheperu kheperu-kua em kheperu en Khepera kheper em sep tepi kheper-kua em kheperu pu en pa-na au pautet aru-na pa-na em pautet Almost mantra, isn't it? Perhaps this notion of self-creation from the materia prima is pertinent to Black Sun symbology. Richard Patz Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 From: jonathan breach Although it may not be viewed my many as an orthodox interpretation of the concepts of the Black Sun, my immediate thoughts on the topic were that the Black Sun reminds literally me of an eclipse, where the moon moves in front of the sun. Alchemically, such an occurance could be viewed as representing "coniunctio", the union of the masculine and feminine elements. What do others think? regards Jonathan Breach From: Bernard Bovasso Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 Jonathan wrote: >Although it may not be viewed my many as an orthodox >interpretation of the concepts of the Black Sun, my immediate >thoughts on the topic were that the Black Sun reminds literally >me of an eclipse, where the moon moves in front of the sun. >Alchemically, such an occurance could be viewed as >representing "coniunctio", the union of the masculine and >feminine elements. Jonathan; That may have been the obvious if the moon were considered female. In a more ancient mythology and cosmology closer to a matricentric culture (such as may have been the case for the people who built Stonehenge, henge circles and the standing stones or menhirs in general), the moon was very much the "man in the moon." I have often characterized the filial moon as the "lunatic" (because wobbly in its orbit) son of Mother Earth who, during the exclipse, literally occludes Papa Sol in quite literal Oedipal fashion (this is also the archetypal motif of Shakespeare's Hamlet). For Stone Hengers the moment following the solar apogee during Summer solstice marked the beginning of the death (descent) of the Father (Sun) and which extended to the Winter solstice immediately after which the new Sun (Son) was born. This motif is retained in the Epiphany. The killing of the Father by the lunatic son at the behest of the Mother (keeping in mind Hesiod's account) is also marked in the eclipse and why eclipses of the sun were so critical for Stonehengers. The motif is uncanily retained in Alchemy in the motif from the Rosarium of the devouring or swallowing of the sun by the "green lion." But there is an ambivalence here since a coniunctio is also implied by the swallowing, as a coitus of the son (Sun) with Beya, the feminine principle as body and physical nature. This would make it a most complete "oedipal" saga insofar as on one hand the son simultaneously slays (eclipses) the Father (Sol) but which is also the Son himself who literaly swallows himself (viz., the orouboros) to represent his coniunctio with *Physis* (as his mother matter). The coital descent into matter, mater, matrix, mother thus commences the nigredo state (of the swallowed by the womb, black sun) and hence a state of death since the womb and tomb are one image. What is astounding here is how the ambivalence of the womb/tomb, birth/death, is retained in the duplexity of eclipsing (killing) the father as simultaneous with the coniunctio with the Mother (Earth, Physis, Beya). Sincerely; Bernard From: Jeffrey Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 Bernard wrote: >The coital descent into matter, mater, matrix, mother >thus commences the nigredo state (of the swallowed by >the womb, black sun) and hence a state of death since >the womb and tomb are one image. What is astounding >here is how the ambivalence of the womb/tomb, birth/death, >is retained in the duplexity of eclipsing (killing) the father as >simultaneous with the coniunctio with the Mother (Earth, >Physis, Beya). Very interesting symbolic motif. I think you are moving deeper into the meaning of the black sun, which might have to do with the "death" of the spirit as it moves into the material world. The transmutation of father into son might have to do with the transformation of the spirit as it moves into the mother realm. For spirit to be experienced and transformed in inner alchemy it must leave its pure state and descend into the psyche. The death of the spirit would therfore also be an incarnation of spirit in the son, though both son and father are killed initially in the process. The ambivalence would derive from this initial death as well as the spirits reluctance to become matter. Jeff From: Bernard Bovasso Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 Jeff: The "the spirits reluctance to become matter" raises some curious issues especially that I understand Spirit in the Stoic sense of *spermatikos,* or seminal in function. This is retained in the Christian idea of the Spirit as the agency impregnating the Virgin Mary, but as the seminal act of the Father. When Christ, as Son, is retained in turn as the Father (Christ as Divine God) the implication of the "Father and I are One" image is that the Son (as Father) impregnates his own mother. Apparently the seminal Spirit is the agency that links Father and Son as One. This may be alarming from a literal standpoint except to understand that the Hermetic or Inner realm of experience is essentially a closed circuit of events where "incest" has a transcendent meaning. This is upheld in a notion of "the spirits reluctance to become matter" insofar as spirit into matter is no more feasible than the contained become the container, and vice versa. The Spirit cannot be transformed into matter (according to a modern notion of the conservation of energy and the interchangeablity of energy and mass), simply because as seminal in nature the Spirit must serve only to indwell the germinal potential for morphological transmutations of Matter. Otherwise such generation would remain in repeat and merely creating copies of the copies, or clones (viz Plato's Timaeus on this). This is even more apparent in Alchemy where the Spirit performs as the Mercurious which is locked, or contained within Matter (the Stone as Mater, Matrix), and must be freed, i.e., as the goal of the Alchemical process. Once freed the interplay between Father and son is renewed but with Matter as the Medium (the Incarnation) for the two, so that the transmutations of material generation may continue as original events in the experience of the operator. This is imperative. Otherwise the world comes to an end as original generation comes to a halt with endless replication of imitations of the imitation. But this is the whole point of Alchemy-- original creation (*arche*) in experience. Sincerely; Bernard |